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Somehow i got involved in this discussion and ended up posting a number of comments explaining the how and why behind Microsoft's push for ISO approval of MS-OOXML. I have been working on a paper titled, "Breaking the Web to Ride the Great Wave". Breaking the Web is what will happen once ISO approves MS-OOXML. The MIcrosoft Stack of Web Servers (Exchange, SharePoint, MS-SQL Server) are integrated into the MSOffice-Outlook desktop. The MS desktop dominates much of the document workflows and business processes of the commercial world. ISO approval of the MSOffice specific MS-OOXML will legitamize MSOffice as an editor of standardized web ready docuemnts. But how MS-OOXML docuemnts become "Web REady" is tricky. In the December 2007 MSOffice SDK beta, we see how this is done. The SDK provides a conversion component for the quick high fidelity conversion of MS-OOXML documents to XAML. XAML is a proprietary part of the WPF (Windows Presentation Foundation) layer of the .NET framework, and is easily paried with Silverlight. Sometimes XAML is referred to as "fixed/flow". XAML is an MS proprietary replacement for the W3C's (X)HTML. Billions of MSOffice docuemnts will make their way to the Web using this SDK converter. The path for transitioning the monopolist hold on desktop business processes to the monopolist stack of web servers is set with this converter. ISO approval of MS-OOXML will enable Microsoft to dodge brining their desktop editor into compliance with advancing W3C standards such as (X)HTML, CSS 3, XForms, SVG and RDF. Instead of these open standards, transitioning business processes will be locked into MS only dependencies; XAML, Silverlight, WinForms, and Smart Tags. The breaking of the web results in a consumer/business cloud dependent on MS proprietary technologies that are out of the reach of Firefox, Apache, Java, and Adobe technologies. Google won't be able to penetrate the business stack, and will be kept very busy trying to defen

Public posturing in overdrive.  Warp speed overdrive. 

Excellent summary from Edward Macnaghten. It all comes down to this: OOXML is designed entirely to extend the Microsoft Desktop Monopoly, leveraging that monopolist control into server systems, devices and the future of the Internet

Excellent summary from Edward Macnaghten. It all comes down to this: OOXML is designed entirely to extend the Microsoft Desktop Monopoly, leveraging that monopolist control into server systems, devices and the future of the Internet

Excellent summary from Edward Macnaghten. It all comes down to this: OOXML is designed entirely to extend the Microsoft Desktop Monopoly, leveraging that monopolist control into server systems, devices and the future of the Internet

This commentary, based on Tim Bray's "Life is Complicated" blog and comment section, was published by Lxer.  Well worth the examination.

The fast track problem may be more serious than most think.  NB's such as the USA Department of Commerce NiST authorized ANSI/INCiTS group, who have opted to keep Ecma 376 on the fast track, may have compromised their legal standing with sponsoring governments. 

As it sits, an ISO/IEC ratification of Ecam 376 would violate International Trade Agreements.  Without a diligent and careful review / amendment of Ecma 376, ISO/IEC is going to find itself in a difficult to explain position.

A wide array of Microsoft sponsored and business affiliated technical punditry has weighed in arguing on behalf of fast tracking Ecma 376, even though the contradictions with existing ISO/IEC product 26300 are <b><a href="http://www.grokdoc.net/index.php/EOOXML_objections"&gt;legion&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/b&gt;.

Marbux is one legal expert quite familiar with International Law and Trade Agreements, and their impact on International Standards.  He has researched the Ecma 376 ISO/IEC contradiictions and fast track process with such thoroughness that his commentary, <b><a href="http://www.opendocumentfellowship.org/node/303"&gt;What is a contradiction at ISO?</a></b> has become a must read. 

~ge~

The fast track problem may be more serious than most think. NB's such as the USA Department of Commerce NiST authorized ANSI/INCiTS group, who have opted to keep Ecma 376 on the fast track, may have compromised their legal standing with sponsoring govern

The fast track problem may be more serious than most think. NB's such as the USA Department of Commerce NiST authorized ANSI/INCiTS group, who have opted to keep Ecma 376 on the fast track, may have compromised their legal standing with sponsoring govern

Great article by Evan Leibovitch.  His approach to the issue of MS Ecma 376 is refreshingly different in that he sees the success of OpenDocument as a user challenge to years of softwware vendor control: 

"For the first time in decades, major IT users are challenging the traditional proprietary formats used by software programs...."

Evan goes on to sight Rob Weirs blog as evidence that MS Ecma 376 continues the long traditon of vendor control through the binidng of file formats to proprietary applications. 

Great article by Evan Leibovitch. His approach to the issue of MS Ecma 376 is refreshingly different in that he sees the success of OpenDocument as a user challenge to years of softwware vendor control:

text

Great article by Evan Leibovitch. His approach to the issue of MS Ecma 376 is refreshingly different in that he sees the success of OpenDocument as a user challenge to years of softwware vendor control:

text

Looks like the road to open standards now detours through Redmond, Washington.  Can we still call the destiny "open standards" if proposals have to be filtered through the Microsoft business plan for world domination?  This is not a good day for America.

The British Standards Institute, which represents the UK with the International Standards Organization, has issued a " contradiction" to Microsoft's specification.

The British Standards Institute, which represents the UK with the International Standards Organization, has issued a " contradiction" to Microsoft's specification.

Yes!  It's Da Vinci time.  I wonder if W^ has downloaded ACME 376 and taken the Da Vinci conversion engine out for a test run?  Belgium and Adobe took a look, and have expressed an interest in getting their hands on the ODF 1.2 version of Da Vinci.  California and Massachusetts have yet to comment about ACME 376, but of course they are also waiting for Da Vinci.

I'll thank W^ for his kind comments, and make sure he knows about the ACME 376 proof of concept.  If DaVinci can hit perfect conversion fidelity with those billions of binary documents using XML encoded RTF, there is no reason why Da Vinci can't do the same with ODF.  We do however need ODF 1.2 to insure that perfect interoperability with other ODF ready applications.

Yes!  It's Da Vinci time.  I wonder if W^ has downloaded ACME 376 and taken the Da Vinci conversion engine out for a test run?  Belgium and Adobe took a look, and have expressed an interest in getting their hands on the ODF 1.2 version of Da Vinci.  California and Massachusetts have yet to comment about ACME 376, but of course they are also waiting for Da Vinci.

I'll thank W^ for his kind comments, and make sure he knows about the ACME 376 proof of concept.  If DaVinci can hit perfect conversion fidelity with those billions of binary documents using XML encoded RTF, there is no reason why Da Vinci can't do the same with ODF.  We do however need ODF 1.2 to insure that perfect interoperability with other ODF ready applications.

Hi guys,

There is an interesting discussion triggered by Tim Bray's "ongoing · Life Is Complicated" blog piece.  Our good friend Mike Champion has some interesting comments defending ISO/IEC approval of MS Ecma 376 based on many arguments.  But this one seems to be the bottom line;

<mike> "there is not an official standard for one that (in the opinion of the people who actually dug deeply into the question, and I have not) represents all the features supported in the MS Office binary formats and can be efficiently loaded and processed without major redesign of MS Office.

..... So, if you want a clean XML format that represents mainstream office document use cases, use ODF. If you want a usable XML foormat that handles existing Word documents with full fidelity and optimal performance in MS Office, use OOXML. If you think this fidelity/performance argument is all FUD, try it with your documents in Open Office / ODF and MS Office 2007 / OOXML and tell the world what you learn." </mike>

Mike's not alone in this.  This seems to be the company line for Microsoft's justification that ISO/IEC should have two conflicting file formats each pomising to do the same thing, becaus eonly one of those formats can handle the bilions of binary documents conversion to XML with an acceptable fidelity. 

This is not true, and we can prove it.  And if we're right  that you can convert the billions of binaries to ODF without loss of fidelity, then there was no "technology" argument for Microsoft not implementing ODF natively and becoming active in the OASIS ODF TC process to improve application interoperability.

<diigo_

Great coverage from InformationWeek about the emerging Enterprise 2.0 arena.  Author Michael Hoover does not get too deep into the Information Processing Chain, as exampled by the integrated Vista Stack of desktop, server, device,Internet systems and services.  But he provides a more than adequate framework for evaluating chain components.

As the ODF - OOXML battle contiues to expand, engulfing swallowing and swamping near everythign in it's path, the day is not too far off when the battle will move to the center of Enterprise 2.0 considerations.  It has to.  XML Hubs are how these converging technologies are going to be gathered, integrated and configured to impact rapidly changing business processes.  There has to be a universal transport in these systems that all applications can work, and nothig matches the highly portable and interactive document/data capabilities of ODF and OOXML.  They alone own the desktop prodcutivity environment migration to XML.  And it will be through XML - RDF/XML that the Hubs finally integrate the flow of information between desktops, servers, devices and Internet systems.

~ge~

The primary difference between ODF and MOOXML is that ODF was designed to be a universal file format.  MOOXML was designed to be an XML file format for MSOffice, the Win32 API, and the Vista Information Processing Chain API (.NET 3.0). 

ODF is application and platform independent.  MOOXML is application and platform specific.  It's bound to the Windows - Vista platform. 

Microsoft's Brian Jones recently got caugh tup in a argument with the heavily armed WMD ODF expert and combatant Sam Hiser (WMD=Words of Massive Destruction).  In their exchange, Brian got confused over this very important distinction between ODF and MOOXML.  ODF allows specific applications to place their configurations and requirements in a settings file that is separate from the content, presentation and metadata containers.  MOOXML on the other hand makes no distinction whatsoever between application specific (MSOffice only) configuration, settings, processsing instructions and systemm dependencies and the rest of the file format contents.  Application settings are bound to content, presentation, and schema containers.  So bound that Brian is seemingly unaware of what ODF has achieved.  Sam caught him by surprise, as did many others posting comments:

Brian Jones on MOOXML support for older versions of MSOffice:  Coments by Sam the WMD Man are below.

The big thing I'm waiting for is other applications like OpenOffice to support custom defined schemas. This would mean that rather than simply sharing wordprocessing or spreadsheet information, we can share actual customer information. For example you c

The big thing I'm waiting for is other applications like OpenOffice to support custom defined schemas. This would mean that rather than simply sharing wordprocessing or spreadsheet information, we can share actual customer information. For example you c

The big thing I'm waiting for is other applications like OpenOffice to support custom defined schemas. This would mean that rather than simply sharing wordprocessing or spreadsheet information, we can share actual customer information. For example you c

There are the technical arguments for ODf vs. EooXML.  Then there are endless discussions concerning the discovery and disclosure of volumes of contradictions between ODF and EooXmL  And how about all those legal-patent-licensing-DRM restrictions on EooXML which shatter in comparison to the truly open and un encumbered ODF.  Even the comparison between ECMA the great rubber stamp standards for sale org vs OASIS, the everyman's consensus community standards mill where ODF flourishes.  All interesting.  but this blog is about the reality of migrating information and information processes to ODF.  It's not easy!

There are the technical arguments for ODf vs. EooXML. Then there are endless discussions concerning the discovery and disclosure of volumes of contradictions between ODF and EooXmL And how about all those legal-patent-licensing-DRM restrictions on EooXM

There are the technical arguments for ODf vs. EooXML. Then there are endless discussions concerning the discovery and disclosure of volumes of contradictions between ODF and EooXmL And how about all those legal-patent-licensing-DRM restrictions on EooXM

In this 2006 article Nick Carr lays out the history of office productivity applications, arguing the Office 2.0 is really Office 3.0 - the generation where desktop productivity office suites mesh with the Web. This article is linked to The Office question, December 18, 2007

In this 2006 article Nick Carr lays out the history of office productivity applications, arguing the Office 2.0 is really Office 3.0 - the generation where desktop productivity office suites mesh with the Web. This article is linked to The Office question, December 18, 2007

Also includes stats in table form indicating that according to Google Search OOXML documents now outnumber ODF documents on the Web, for word processor documents, spreadsheet documents, and presentation documents.

.... "I recently described how Google's Wave, a collaboration tool based on the new HTML 5 standard, demonstrated the potential for Web applications to unglue Microsoft's hold on customers. My post quoted Gary Edwards, the former president of the Open Document Foundation, a first-hand witness to the failed attempt by Massachusetts to dump Microsoft and as experienced a hand at Microsoft-tilting as anyone I know......"