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Gary Edwards

Brian Jones: Open XML Formats : Open XML support in older versions of Office - 0 views

  • The big thing I'm waiting for is other applications like OpenOffice to support custom defined schemas. This would mean that rather than simply sharing wordprocessing or spreadsheet information, we can share actual customer information. For example you could take health care data, or invoice data, or RFP data from one of the applications and move it over to the other without losing that semantic meaning. It would be like that demo many of you have seen me do where I take data from a table in Excel and move it over to Word where it's formatted more like a catalog.
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    The big thing I'm waiting for is other applications like OpenOffice to support custom defined schemas. This would mean that rather than simply sharing wordprocessing or spreadsheet information, we can share actual customer information. For example you c
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    The big thing I'm waiting for is other applications like OpenOffice to support custom defined schemas. This would mean that rather than simply sharing wordprocessing or spreadsheet information, we can share actual customer information. For example you c
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    The big thing I'm waiting for is other applications like OpenOffice to support custom defined schemas. This would mean that rather than simply sharing wordprocessing or spreadsheet information, we can share actual customer information. For example you c
Gary Edwards

Open Stack: Game Time for OpenDocument - 0 views

  • IMHO, it all comes down to one question: > *... Is ODF able to handle everything EOOXML was designed for? Is there something you can do in EOOXML that can't be done with ODF? > Microsoft insists that the reason they developed EOOXML is that ODF is inadequate and unable to handle the advanced features of MSOffice, and, most importantly, the billions of binary legacy documents produced by the many versions of MSOffice still in production. > The answer to this question is that ODF can handle everything MSOffice can throw at it. > There are two ways of proving this. >
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    The primary difference between ODF and MOOXML is that ODF was designed to be a universal file format.  MOOXML was designed to be an XML file format for MSOffice, the Win32 API, and the Vista Information Processing Chain API (.NET 3.0). 

    ODF is application and platform independent.  MOOXML is application and platform specific.  It's bound to the Windows - Vista platform. 

    Microsoft's Brian Jones recently got caugh tup in a argument with the heavily armed WMD ODF expert and combatant Sam Hiser (WMD=Words of Massive Destruction).  In their exchange, Brian got confused over this very important distinction between ODF and MOOXML.  ODF allows specific applications to place their configurations and requirements in a settings file that is separate from the content, presentation and metadata containers.  MOOXML on the other hand makes no distinction whatsoever between application specific (MSOffice only) configuration, settings, processsing instructions and systemm dependencies and the rest of the file format contents.  Application settings are bound to content, presentation, and schema containers.  So bound that Brian is seemingly unaware of what ODF has achieved.  Sam caught him by surprise, as did many others posting comments:

    Brian Jones on MOOXML support for older versions of MSOffice:  Coments by Sam the WMD Man are below.


Gary Edwards

EOOXML objections - Grokdoc - 0 views

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    Marbux has done some heroic work here, using the GrokDoc Wiki.  The Title is "EOOXML Objections", and it's primary purpose is to help ISO National Body Memebers evaluate the 0ver 6,000 pages of the Microsoft - ECMA Office Open XML Specification for MSOffice. 

    On January 5th, 2007, Microsoft officially submitted EOOXML to ISO under the fast track rules.  Before EOOXML can hit the fast track though, ISO provides members with a 30 day "Contradition Review Phase".   During this brief phase, ISO NB's (national standards body members) muct evaluate the proposal and post their allegations concerning contradictions and inconsistencies with other ISO products - like ODF.

    What Marbux is assembling here is a one stop shop for ISO NB's strugglign to understand the issues at stake.  It's incredible wha the has accomplished in such a short time.  But then, the clock is ticking.  February 5th is a hard and unmovable deadline. 

    The basic contradiction is thatt EOOXML is a subset of ISO existing product, ODF.  Both attempt to do the exact same thing:  provide an XML file format for desktop productivity environments such as MSOffice, OpenOffice, and WordPerfect Office.  What seriously differentiates the two is that ODF was designed expressly to be a universal file format, application and platform independent, able to transition across many different information domains connecting the legacy of desktop productivity to near everything else.  MOOXML on the other hand was designed for MSOffice and the legacy of billions of binary documents that only Micrsoft knows the secrets to converting to XML.  As such, MOOXML is designed to be application and platform bound, with these proprietary dependencies written right into the specification.

    One of the more important elements of the Marbux arguments is that the OpenDocument Foundation's daVinci Plugin and InfoSet Engine - API prove conclusively
Gary Edwards

fr0mat.net: PLUGIN: Default to ODF - 0 views

  • This permits individuals & organizations to configure their PCs to open, save and work primarily in the ISO OpenDocument Format.
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    No, it does much more.  The default file setting feature is what will break the monopolists iron grip!
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    No, it does much more.  The default file setting feature is what will break the monopolists iron grip!
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    No, it does much more.  The default file setting feature is what will break the monopolists iron grip!
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    No, it does much more.  The default file setting feature is what will break the monopolists iron grip!
Gary Edwards

ongoing · Life Is Complicated - 0 views

  • Fortunately for Microsoft, the DaVinci plugin is coming, which will enable Microsoft office applications to comply with ISO 26300. We all understand the financial issues that prompted the push to make OOXML a standard (see Tim's comment above and http://lnxwalt.wordpress.com/2007/01/21/whose-finances-are-on-the-line/ for more on this) and ensure continued vendor lock-in. However, OOXML is not the answer.
  • ODF can handle everything and anything Microsoft Office can throw at it. Including the legacy billions of binary documents, years of MSOffice bound business processes, and even tricky low level reaching add-ons represented by assistive technologies.
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    Yes!  It's Da Vinci time.  I wonder if W^ has downloaded ACME 376 and taken the Da Vinci conversion engine out for a test run?  Belgium and Adobe took a look, and have expressed an interest in getting their hands on the ODF 1.2 version of Da Vinci.  California and Massachusetts have yet to comment about ACME 376, but of course they are also waiting for Da Vinci.

    I'll thank W^ for his kind comments, and make sure he knows about the ACME 376 proof of concept.  If DaVinci can hit perfect conversion fidelity with those billions of binary documents using XML encoded RTF, there is no reason why Da Vinci can't do the same with ODF.  We do however need ODF 1.2 to insure that perfect interoperability with other ODF ready applications.
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    Yes!  It's Da Vinci time.  I wonder if W^ has downloaded ACME 376 and taken the Da Vinci conversion engine out for a test run?  Belgium and Adobe took a look, and have expressed an interest in getting their hands on the ODF 1.2 version of Da Vinci.  California and Massachusetts have yet to comment about ACME 376, but of course they are also waiting for Da Vinci.

    I'll thank W^ for his kind comments, and make sure he knows about the ACME 376 proof of concept.  If DaVinci can hit perfect conversion fidelity with those billions of binary documents using XML encoded RTF, there is no reason why Da Vinci can't do the same with ODF.  We do however need ODF 1.2 to insure that perfect interoperability with other ODF ready applications.
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    Yes!  It's Da Vinci time.  I wonder if W^ has downloaded ACME 376 and taken the Da Vinci conversion engine out for a test run?  Belgium and Adobe took a look, and have expressed an interest in getting their hands on the ODF 1.2 version of Da Vinci.  California and Massachusetts have yet to comment about ACME 376, but of course they are also waiting for Da Vinci.

    I'll thank W^ for his kind comments, and make sure he knows about the ACME 376 proof of concept.  If DaVinci can hit perfect conversion fidelity with those billions of binary documents using XML encoded RTF, there is no reason why Da Vinci can't do the same with ODF.  We do however need ODF 1.2 to insure that perfect interoperability with other ODF ready applications.
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    Hi guys,

    There is an interesting discussion triggered by Tim Bray's "ongoing · Life Is Complicated" blog piece.  Our good friend Mike Champion has some interesting comments defending ISO/IEC approval of MS Ecma 376 based on many arguments.  But this one seems to be the bottom line;

    <mike> "there is not an official standard for one that (in the opinion of the people who actually dug deeply into the question, and I have not) represents all the features supported in the MS Office binary formats and can be efficiently loaded and processed without major redesign of MS Office.

    ..... So, if you want a clean XML format that represents mainstream office document use cases, use ODF. If you want a usable XML foormat that handles existing Word documents with full fidelity and optimal performance in MS Office, use OOXML. If you think this fidelity/performance argument is all FUD, try it with your documents in Open Office / ODF and MS Office 2007 / OOXML and tell the world what you learn." </mike>

    Mike's not alone in this.  This seems to be the company line for Microsoft's justification that ISO/IEC should have two conflicting file formats each pomising to do the same thing, becaus eonly one of those formats can handle the bilions of binary documents conversion to XML with an acceptable fidelity. 

    This is not true, and we can prove it.  And if we're right  that you can convert the billions of binaries to ODF without loss of fidelity, then there was no "technology" argument for Microsoft not implementing ODF natively and becoming active in the OASIS ODF TC process to improve application interoperability.

    <diigo_
Gary Edwards

Brian Jones: Open XML Formats : Office Open XML final draft!!! - 0 views

  • # re: Office Open XML final draft!!! @ Wednesday, October 11, 2006 1:46 PM The past incarnations of DrawingML have been chaotic. It would be interesting, out of curiosity, to get an accurate history of what changed over time, perhaps to better understand what is supported in what. Here is my take, I am pretty sure I got at least 50% of it wrong :-) - pre-Windows 95 era, Word, Excel and Powerpoint use their own vector drawing layer used to draw shapes, pictures, diagrams, art and charts. Powerpoint, acquired by Microsoft in 1987, has by far the advanced drawing layer (bi-linear gradients, opacity, ...), codenamed Escher (in reference of the famous mathematician). - In Office 95, it is decided to reuse the Powerpoint vector graphics layer in Word and Excel. Migration begins. - Migration ends with Office 97 where both Word, Excel and Powerpoint use the same vector graphics layer, publicly known as MSO (mso97.dll) - In Office 2000, it's all craze about internet and Word tries to export WYSIWYG html. For that end, mark up extensions must be added to account for the MSO drawing layer. Hence the VML (Vector Markup language). Excel and Powerpoint don't support it. Internet Explorer natively supports VML (Internet Explorer's Direct animation vector drawing layer dismissed for performance reasons). - In Office XP, VML migration ends and both Word, Excel and Powerpoint support VML whenever a document is saved as a "Single web page archive" (.mhtml extension). - In Office 2003, nothing changes. - In Office 12, MSO gets rewritten with backwards compatibility in mind. The vector drawing layer uses more sophisticated drawing functionalities which makes it easier to draw themed, 3D realistic &nbsp;objects. Technically, the differences are akin to the differences between GDI and GDI+. This new shared library is known as E2O and the corresponding mark up language is known as Drawing ML (Ecma TC45 specs). - In Office 14, ??? perhaps the drawing layer is rewritten, again, to 1) use WPF 2) to allow plugins, hence enabling much more sophisticated do-it-yourself scenarios. Use cases : custom charts ; BI analysis tools. Stephane Rodriguez
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    Stephen Rodriguez gives a quick history of the MSO <> VML <> DrawingML transition in the Microsoft Product line. Note that MSOffice produces two versions of EOOXML file formats. On import os a legacy document, MSOffice will convert the doc and produce a
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    Stephen Rodriguez gives a quick history of the MSO <> VML <> DrawingML transition in the Microsoft Product line. Note that MSOffice produces two versions of EOOXML file formats. On import os a legacy document, MSOffice will convert the doc and produce a
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    Stephen Rodriguez gives a quick history of the MSO <> VML <> DrawingML transition in the Microsoft Product line. Note that MSOffice produces two versions of EOOXML file formats. On import os a legacy document, MSOffice will convert the doc and produce a
Gary Edwards

Link to this site | Open Document - 0 views

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    The new logo for the OpenDocument wiki at XML.org is out.  This page also carries a link to OASIS ODF Blogs.  Nothing yet about the controversial MEOOXML submission to ISO that took place on Friday, January 5th, 2007.  The submission triggers the critically important ISO Contradiction Review Phase, where ISO members have 30 days to review the 6,000 page MEOOXML submission and post any allegations of possible contradictions or inconsistencies.

    If MEOOXML (Microsoft-ECMA Office Open XML) can pass through the contradiction without complaint,  the 6,000 page specification describing XML encoding of MSOffice specific binary processes gets to move on to the fast track phase.

    This is very sneaky stuff.  Micrsoft tried to submit MEOOXML to ISO in mid December.  Perhaps in hopes of catching an extra 20 or so days of holiday right in the midst of the critical 30 day contradiction review period.  Apparently the USA representative to ISO JTSC1 refused the submission until after the hollidays.  Still, with near zero publicity, and 6,000 pages of crap to sludge through, the review phase has begun. 

    IMHO, only the ODF experts can effectively point out the ocntradictions and inconsistencies with the MEOOXML submission.  So this is a call for Rob Weir, Florian Reuter, Patrick Durusau, Sam Hiser, David A Wheeler, Bruce D'Arcus, the legendary Daniel Vogelheim, and the infamous Marbux to step forward with the full force of their expertise. 

    Since Florian has the most experience with the hapless and tragically deceptive MS-Novel-CleverAge Translator Project, where the glaringly obvious contradictions and inconsistencies are being hastily pasted over, i'm anxious to see where his blog takes us:
    http://florianreuter.blogspot.com/

    ~ge~

  • ...1 more comment...
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    The new logo for the OpenDocument wiki at XML.org is out. This page also carries a link to OASIS ODF Blogs. Nothing yet about the controversial MEOOXML submission to ISO that took place on Friday, January 5th, 2007. The submission triggers the critical
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    The new logo for the OpenDocument wiki at XML.org is out. This page also carries a link to OASIS ODF Blogs. Nothing yet about the controversial MEOOXML submission to ISO that took place on Friday, January 5th, 2007. The submission triggers the critical
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    The new logo for the OpenDocument wiki at XML.org is out. This page also carries a link to OASIS ODF Blogs. Nothing yet about the controversial MEOOXML submission to ISO that took place on Friday, January 5th, 2007. The submission triggers the critical
Gary Edwards

GROKLAW - 0 views

Gary Edwards

The History of OpenDocument,: The battle between Massachusetts and Microsoft - 0 views

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    Excellent historical summary of the battle between Massachusetts adn Microsft over the OpenDocument XML file format. Grea ttime line, with many useful links. One thing missing is an explanation of why XML?
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    Excellent historical summary of the battle between Massachusetts adn Microsft over the OpenDocument XML file format. Grea ttime line, with many useful links. One thing missing is an explanation of why XML?
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    Excellent historical summary of the battle between Massachusetts adn Microsft over the OpenDocument XML file format. Grea ttime line, with many useful links. One thing missing is an explanation of why XML?
Gary Edwards

From Open Source to Open Standard: The OASIS OpenDocument Format - 0 views

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    The history of OpenDocument by Michael Brauer,
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    The history of OpenDocument by Michael Brauer,
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    The history of OpenDocument by Michael Brauer,
Gary Edwards

Gmail - [office] Clarification for frame formatting property style:flow-with-text - Flock - 0 views

  • Some notes on the history of this feature in OpenOffice.org Writer:Prior to OpenOffice.org 2.0, text frames, embedded object and graphicsare clipped/captured inside its layout environment and flow with thetext flow, if possible. The reason for this was, that the contentstructure also determines the layout structure - e.g. a paragraph insidea page header have to stay inside the page header.Shapes (drawing objects in OpenOffice.org) unfortunately doesn't followthis rule.For OpenOffice.org 2.0, we needed to unify text frames, embeddedobjects, graphics and shapes. Thus, this frame formatting property hasbeen proposed. This need was also influenced by interoperabilityrequests for the binary Microsoft Word file format and the MicrosoftWord layout.
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    Aha!  I mentioned in an earlier bookmark that Sun was involved in the Belgium ODF - OOXML Pilot Study.  It was disclosed by Peter V. (Belgium Consultant to Peter Strick's group) that Sun was proposing changes to the ODF 1.2 specification, after the close date, to improve the conversion fidelity problem their plug-in is having in the trials.  We tried to do the same thing to save ODF in Massachusetts.  Sun didn't have a plug-in for the Massachusetts trials, and opposed our iX interop enhancements and extensions.  I guess they are beginning to understand why the iX proposals are so important? 

    If you can't convert MS binaries and xml to ODF, then there is no use in the real world for ODF.  It's that simple.   In California, the CIO's routinely refer to this problem as, "ODF is impossible to implement".

    ~ge~

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    Summary of First ODF Summit held in Armonk, organized by IBM and Sun. List of names for all attendees
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    Summary of First ODF Summit held in Armonk, organized by IBM and Sun. List of names for all attendees
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    Summary of First ODF Summit held in Armonk, organized by IBM and Sun. List of names for all attendees
Gary Edwards

OASIS Open Document Format for Office Applications (OpenDocument) TC - 0 views

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    ODF FAQ written by Michael Brauer with editing by David Faure. Excellent discussion of differences between ODF and MSXML and, the OASIS ODF TC process and the ECMA MSXML process
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    ODF FAQ written by Michael Brauer with editing by David Faure. Excellent discussion of differences between ODF and MSXML and, the OASIS ODF TC process and the ECMA MSXML process
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    ODF FAQ written by Michael Brauer with editing by David Faure. Excellent discussion of differences between ODF and MSXML and, the OASIS ODF TC process and the ECMA MSXML process
Gary Edwards

http://www.fr0mat.net/ - 0 views

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    Very nice job Sam!
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    Very nice job Sam!
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    Very nice job Sam!
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    Very nice job Sam!
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    Very nice job Sam!
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    Very nice job Sam!
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    Very nice job Sam!
Gary Edwards

Open Sources | InfoWorld | The Future of Lock-in | May 17, 2006 08:56 AM | By Matt Asay - 0 views

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    Whoa, Matt Asay knocks one out of the ballpark! Finally a Web 2.0 provider who understands the importance of the Exchange/SharePoint Hub, and the long term lockin of critical day to day business processes that Microsoft has brewing. One thing he doesn't
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    Whoa, Matt Asay knocks one out of the ballpark! Finally a Web 2.0 provider who understands the importance of the Exchange/SharePoint Hub, and the long term lockin of critical day to day business processes that Microsoft has brewing. One thing he doesn't
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    Whoa, Matt Asay knocks one out of the ballpark! Finally a Web 2.0 provider who understands the importance of the Exchange/SharePoint Hub, and the long term lockin of critical day to day business processes that Microsoft has brewing. One thing he doesn't
Gary Edwards

Regrettable word choice -- Andy Updegrove's comment on "Microsoft releases FAQ on Ecma ... - 0 views

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    Microsoft ECMA Submission, Covenant to Sue, and FAQ. FAQ clearly contradicts the covenanant to sue?
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    Microsoft ECMA Submission, Covenant to Sue, and FAQ. FAQ clearly contradicts the covenanant to sue?
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    Microsoft ECMA Submission, Covenant to Sue, and FAQ. FAQ clearly contradicts the covenanant to sue?
Gary Edwards

NewsForge | SCALE Announces Workshop On Open Standards For Government - 0 views

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    OpenDocument Fellowship, Gary Edwards - OpenOffice.org, J. David eisenberg - Fellowship
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    OpenDocument Fellowship, Gary Edwards - OpenOffice.org, J. David eisenberg - Fellowship
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    OpenDocument Fellowship, Gary Edwards - OpenOffice.org, J. David eisenberg - Fellowship
Gary Edwards

Microsoft (COMP/C-3/37.792 - Antitrust) [2004] ECComm 1 (24 March 2004) - 0 views

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    European Union Anti Trust action against Microsoft. Begins with 1998 complaint from Sun involving browsers and Java. Extends through DRM and digital media players. Great discussion of key terms such as interoperabiltiy, interfaces, system call, platfor
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    European Union Anti Trust action against Microsoft. Begins with 1998 complaint from Sun involving browsers and Java. Extends through DRM and digital media players. Great discussion of key terms such as interoperabiltiy, interfaces, system call, platfor
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    European Union Anti Trust action against Microsoft. Begins with 1998 complaint from Sun involving browsers and Java. Extends through DRM and digital media players. Great discussion of key terms such as interoperabiltiy, interfaces, system call, platfor
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