twine had toggle, neither really works, consider what we are trying to do:

know what has occured since last here (very important!!!!)
understand how conversation developed (chronology)
understand structure of conversation (threaded)

the 'occured since last here' touches on synchronous vs asynch in that if you are constantly synchronous you cannot miss anything

IM is synchronous 2 party for the most part, but I still have multiple topics in one IM with one other person, need threading there too

also tied up with rich presence as well (understanding who is synch who is not, who posted synchronously / asynch'ly - following a conversation is complex, if you are 'there' you need to follow multiple threads and multiple participants, if you are not there, you may want to 'catch up' in an organic way or by scanning the structure of the conversation, you may be disinterested in certain threads and want to de-clutter by hiding them, you may be disproportionately interested in certain parties and want to somehow hilight them

screen real estate is an issue here as well - I may not be able to view the whole thread but I may be very interested in jumping into a hot spot in the conversation that is off page currently - following the interesting crowd at the cocktail party if you will. This is clearly not because you will miss something (unlike the cocktail party) but that you will miss the rich interaction and ability to influence the conversation and maximize leverage with valuable minds.

I have suggested that presence blips on the scroll bar would be useful, some change if active vs 'last at' also indicate attention this way - show where frank is looking at a thread right now, even if not typing - gwave has issues with simply showing activity so there may be technical hurdles here

brings in brin's concepts of social filtering, attention, keyword filtering etc

forking / splitting and Perspectives come into this as well

boy diigo is pissing me off crashing firefox, have switched to chrome - long posts cause issues and then I lose them (auto save people!!!) anyhow. /rant

The predominant model of systems to date has been to analyse your domain, model it, implement it in a rdbms then code access to it (forms on tables). Simplistic but largely true. RDF triplestores among other things allow 'stacking' of data which does not require schema in advance, only equivalency mappings (or standards). We need to decide what we consider foundational to the system (schema in advance) and what will be provided as structure after the fact - architecturally we need to allow both modes - and given extensibility, we must also provide reference structures to provide minimum functionality with a set of "structures after the fact' provided up front (yes I'm aware of the cognitive dissonance there)

if a post is made to a group that is a sub-group of another post is promoted based on settings (if setting is 'ask' then system will ask on posting whether to promote) this adds 'enable post promotion' to the group settings and I suppose 'disallow post promotion into this group' for parent groups to avoid hyperspam

really more *net than HBSN, but thinking ahead>>> architecture posted earlier with content producer literally keeping posession, serving out content with a pay and privacy wrapper to sites who do nothing but resolve to the content (ie don't keep it) sort of like video embeds that can be yanked remotely - I will be paying attention to this guy

incidentally though I have yet to clear through his blog, lots of interesting headings in there, it's not just the content that can be bought and sold, the metadata sets (aspects, object types, class types) can be much more readily sold as can the next level of indirection, presentations for those aspects - next item up for bids is the structure (or instance relations) when one 'adopts' a piece of someone's perspective it could register a microtransaction of value. paying for interest in a piece of content makes more sense than paying for reading it, though interest is a bit trickier to ascertain - value assignment can be done in arrears by tracking liquidity events through the corpus of material the person getting that liquidity has 'experienced' in their travels, ie they may have been 'influenced' by another piece of music in their composition and not even realize it, but the music analysis bot and history bot will suck that money down to the original composer, which takes me to a post wildcat shared about IP, will go find now... scuffle scuffle

cheap servers, everyone can get one, then we get a power server to run the presentation server

Server server model - not thin client - server Content is on owned server - published out with privacy and pay wrapper When you want to you can 'sell' content to services - you still control it they get it by call out Ajax left behind at presentation service We build reference front end Own the means of production ie a server Tyrant would make it illegal for anyone to own a server (printing press) On the welcome page we can redirect new users for ISP and personal server host, take cut Just collect all the producers together and tell them they can own and control evthg they publish, period, then publishing services will come running Take a vig on the pay wrapper /kdl

so post chat with Frank, some clarifications: server server model, doesn't imply server must be outside the laptop on your desk, but it is highly recommended, as the server has the following qualities 1) always on (ppl can't see your content, anywhere, if it isn't, and you do want that cash register to be ticking) 2) in fully redundant environment 3) replication/sync to your local box (DR, B/R) 4) network attached with server isp account (ie fixed ip) of course there is nothing wrong with having the server in your basement, but you have to provide all of that yourself. if you don't trust the ability to clear your server remotely or the physical security of your colo, then you may have to host in your basement, next to your safe full of gold.

note that all elements of this model (structure (relations and aspects), content, presentations) have a privacy and value exchange wrapper on them and can be 'bought and sold' using a value exchange model, this may be everything from rick/frank/twain agreeing to exchange content for content straight up to a start up firm valuing all aspects of contribution to the start up, including things like commitment, deliverables, ip, validation, ideas etc.

it's shiny

perhaps we should be checking out Cargo

while this is not a social network, MUCH to learn from here, architecturally, conceptually

maybe we need a new browser?

'fraid not. this is just a toolkit

I really should 'share' this to alerts management feature post in this group if I could do so easily I would. I run gmail in my browser to do 'alerts managment' something it does very poorly in concert with the variety of implementations of alerts from each socnet, this is something that can and should be improved