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Daniel Jomphe

An introduction to git-svn for Subversion/SVK users and deserters - 0 views

  • This article is aimed at people who want to contribute to projects which are using Subversion as their code-wiki
  • Subversion users can skip SVK and move straight onto git-svn with this tutorial.
  • People who are responsible for Subversion servers and are converting them to git in order to lay them down to die are advised to consider the one-off git-svnimport, which is useful for bespoke conversions where you don't necessarily want to leave SVN/CVS/etc breadcrumbs behind. I'll mention bespoke conversions at the end of the tutorial, and the sort of thing that you end up doing with them.
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  • A lot of this tutorial is dedicated to advocacy, sadly necessary. Those who would rather just cut to the chase will probably want to skip straight to
  • Another way of looking at it is to say that it's really a content- addressable filesystem, used to track directory trees.
  • we've got a simple and efficient filesystem which competes with RevML but is XML free
  • Subversion added nothing to CVS' development model.
  • Yes, it's a bunch of small programs that do one thing and do it well, get over it, they're being unified
  • There's also a pure Java
  • I used to push strongly for SVK, but got brow-beaten by people who were getting far more out of their version control system than I knew possible until I saw what they were talking about.
  • SVK could easily use git as a backing filesystem and drop the dependency on Subversion altogether. So could bzr or hg.
  • The repository model (see right) is also simple enough that there are complete git re-implementations you can draw upon, in a variety of languages.
  • git is first and foremost a toolkit for writing VCS systems
  • Writing a tool to do something that you want is often quite a simple matter of plugging together a few core commands. It's simple enough that once a few basic concepts are there, you begin to feel comfortable knowing that the repository just can't wedge, changes can be discarded yet not lost unless you request them to be cleaned up, etc.
  • I really haven't seen a nicer tool than gitk for browsing a repository.
  • gitk does some really cool things but is most useful when looking at projects that have cottoned onto feature branches (see feature branches, below). If you're looking at a project where everyone commits largely unrelated changes to one branch it just ends up a straight line, and not very interesting.
  • You can easily publish your changes for others who are switched on to git to pull. At a stretch, you can just throw the .git directory on an HTTP server somewhere and publish the path.
  • There's the git-daemon for more efficient serving of repositories (at least, in terms of network use), and gitweb.cgi to provide a visualisation of a git repository.
  • With Subversion, everyone has to commit their changes back to the central wiki, I mean repository, to share them.
  • With Git (actually this is completely true for other distributed systems), it's trivial to push and pull changes between each other. If what you're pulling has common history then git will just pull the differences.
  • If the person publishes their repository as described above, using the git-daemon(1), http or anything else that you can get your kernel to map to its VFS, then you can set it up as a "remote" and pull from it
  • Most people say "but I don't want branches". But users of darcs report that they didn't know how much they really did want branches, but never knew until darcs made it so easy. In essence every change can behave as a branch, and this isn't painful.
  • Because you can easily separate your repositories into stable branches, temporary branches, etc, then you can easily set up programs that only let commits through if they meet criteria of your choosing.
  • Because you can readily work on branches without affecting the stable branch, it is perfectly acceptable for a stable branch to be updated by a single maintainer only
  • Some repositories, for instance the Linux kernel, run a policy of no commit may break the build. What this means is that if you have a problem, you can use bisection to work out which patch introduced the bug.
  • You might use a continual integration server that is responsible for promoting branches to trunk should they pass the strictures that you set.
  • There is an awful lot less to keep in your head, and you don't have to do things like plan branching in advance.
  • Good feature branches mean you end up prototyping well-developed changes; the emphasis shifts away from making atomic commits. If you forgot to add a file, or made some other little mistake, it's easy to go back and change it. If you haven't even pushed your changes anywhere, that's not only fine, but appreciated by everyone involved. Review and revise before you push is the counter-balance to frequent commits.
  • Not only is the implementation fast locally, it's very network efficient, and the protocol for exchanging revisions is also very good at figuring out what needs to be transferred quickly. This is a huge difference - one repository hosted on Debian's Alioth SVN server took 2 days to synchronise because the protocol is so chatty. Now it fits in 3 megs and would not take that long to synchronise over a 150 baud modem.
  • Disk might be cheap, but my /home is always full - git has a separate step for compacting repositories, which means that delta compression can be far more effective. If you're a compression buff, think of it as having an arbitrarily sized window, because when delta compressing git is able to match strings anywhere else in the repository - not just the file which is the notional ancestor of the new revision.
  • Disk might be cheap, but my /home is always full - git has a separate step for compacting repositories, which means that delta compression can be far more effective. If you're a compression buff, think of it as having an arbitrarily sized window, because when delta compressing git is able to match strings anywhere else in the repository - not just the file which is the notional ancestor of the new revision. This space efficiency affects everything - the virtual memory footprint in your buffercache while mining information from the repository, how much data needs to be transferred during "push" and "pull" operations, and so on. Compare that to Subversion, which even when merging between branches is incapable of using the same space for the changes hitting the target branch. The results speak for themselves - I have observed an average of 10 to 1 space savings going from Subversion FSFS to git.
  • Perhaps somebody has already made a conversion of the project and put it somewhere
  • But people who use git are used to treating their repositories as a revision data warehouse which they use to mine useful information when they are trying to understand a codebase.
  • importing the whole repository from Subversion
  • If you like, you can skip early revisions using the -r option to git-fetch.
  • make a local branch for development
  • The name "foo" is completely private; it's just a local name you're assigning to the piece of work you're doing. Eventually you will learn to group related commits onto branches, called "topic branches", as described in the introduction.
  • Say you want to take a project, and work on it somewhere else in a different direction, you can just make a copy using cp or your favourite file manager. Contrast this with Subversion, where you have to fiddle around with branches/ paths, svn cp, svn switch, etc
  • Each of those copies is fully independent, and can diverge freely. You can easily push and pull changes between them without tearing your hair out.
  • Each time you have a new idea, make a new branch and work in that.
  • git svn init
    • Daniel Jomphe
       
      I used git svn clone instead
    • Daniel Jomphe
       
      I used git svn clone instead (with the same parameters)
  • git svn fetch
    • Daniel Jomphe
       
      this wasn't needed b/c of clone instead of init
  • But anyway, that copying was too slow and heavy. We don't want to copy 70MB each time we want to work on a new idea. We want to create new branches at the drop of a hat. Maybe you don't want to copy the actual repository, just make another checkout. We can use git-clone again
  • The -l option to git-clone told git to hardlink the objects together, so not only are these two sharing the same repository but they can still be moved around independently. Cool. I now have two checkouts I can work with, build software in, etc.
  • But all that's a lot of work and most of the time I don't care to create lots of different directories for all my branches. I can just make a new branch and switch to it immediately with git-checkout:
  • Once you have some edits you want to commit, you can use git-commit to commit them. Nothing (not even file changes) gets committed by default; you'll probably find yourself using git-commit -a to get similar semantics to svn commit.
  • There is also a GUI for preparing commits in early (but entirely functional) stages of development.
  • People used to darcs or SVK's interactive commit will like to try git add -i
  • correcting changes in your local branch
  • If it's the top commit, you can just add --amend to your regular git-commit command to, well, amend the last commit. If you explored the git-gui interface, you might have noticed the "Amend Last Commit" switch as well.
  • You can also uncommit. The command for this is git-reset
  • HEAD~1 is a special syntax that means "one commit before the reference called HEAD". HEAD^ is a slightly shorter shorthand for the same thing. I could have also put a complete revision number, a partial (non-ambiguous) revision number, or something like remotes/trunk. See git-rev-parse(1) for the full list of ways in which you can specify revisions.
  • I sometimes write commands like `gitk --all `git-fsck | awk '/dangling commit/ {print $3}'`' to see all the commits in the repository, not just the ones with "post-it notes" (aka references) stuck to them.
  • In this scenario, we'll assume that what I'm currently working on isn't finished, either - and I don't want to have to finish it first. It's not ready. I'm just going to call it "WIP".
  • "Another" way to revise commits is to make a branch from the point a few commits ago, then make a new series of commits that is revised in the way that you want. This is the same scenario as before.
  • I've introduced a new command there - git-cherry-pick. This takes a commit and tries to copy its changes to the branch you've currently got checked out. This technique is called rebasing commits. There is also a git-rebase command which probably would have been fewer commands than the above. But that's my way.
  • Using Git opens the door to a bazaar of VCS tools rather than sacrificing your projects at the altar of one.
  • keep your local branch up to date with Subversion
  • The recommended way to do this for people familiar with Subversion is to use git-svn rebase.
  • Note: before you do this, you should have a "clean" working tree - no local uncommitted changes. You can use git-stash (git 1.5.3+) to hide away local uncommitted changes for later.
  • This command is doing something similar to the above commands that used git-cherry-pick; it's copying the changes from one point on the revision tree to another
  • Better still is to bunch up your in-progress working copy changes into a set of unfinished commits, using git add -i (or git-gui / git-citool). Then try the rebase. You'll end up this time with more commits on top of the SVN tree than just one, so using Stacked Git you can "stg uncommit -n 4" (if you broke your changes into 4 commits), then use "stg pop" / "stg push" to wind around the stack (as well as "stg refresh" when finished making changes) to finish them - see
  • in my experience stg is the best tool for rebasing
  • Once you grok that, you'll only need to use stg and git-svn fetch.
  • Ok, so you've already gone and made the commits locally that you wanted to publish back to the Subversion server. Perhaps you've even made a collection of changes, revising each change to be clearly understandable, making a single small change well such that the entire series of changes can be easily reviewed by your fellow project contributors. It is now time to publish your changes back to Subversion. The command to use is git svn dcommit. The d stands for delta
  • git-svn won't let the server merge revisions on the fly; if there were updates since you fetched / rebased, you'll have to do that again.
  • People are not used to this, thinking somehow that if somebody commits something to file A, then somebody else commits something to file B, the server should make a merged version with both changes, despite neither of the people committing actually having a working tree with both changes. This suffers from the same fundamental problem that darcs' patch calculus does - that just because patches apply 'cleanly' does not imply that they make sense - such a decision can only be automatically made with a dedicated continual integration (smoke) server.
  • This is normally what I use in preference to rebase.
  • This will merge all the commits that aren't in your ancestry, but are in the ancestry of the branch trunk (try setting rightmost drop-down in gitk to 'ancestor' and clicking around to get a feel for what this means), and make a new commit which has two parents - your old HEAD, and whatever commit trunk is up to.
  • there are many shortfallings in git.
  • Sadly, this model is in use by virtually every Subversion hosted project out there. And that is going to be hard to undo.
  • Left: what darcs thinks when you start committing without marking tag points.
  • Right: Subversion has a somewhat smaller brain...
  • It is possible to use git in this way (see the figure to the right) - but it's not trivial, and not default. In fact git itself is developed in this way, using feature branches, aka topic branches.
  • bzr comes with some great utilities like the Patch Queue Manager which helps show you your feature branches. With PQM, you just create a branch with a description of what you're trying to do, make it work against the version that you branched off, and then you're done. The branch can be updated to reflect changes in trunk, and eventually merged and closed.
  • Windows support is good. Consistent implementation. Experience with the distributed development model. Friendly and approachable author and core team.
  • Actually the models of git and bzr are similar enough that bzr could be fitted atop of the git repository model
  • Mercurial is missing lightweight branches that makes git so powerful, and there is no content hashing, so it doesn't really do the whole "revision protocol" thing like git.
  • If you're on Windows it's probably a lot easier to get going.
  • git-svn fetch
    • Daniel Jomphe
       
      was not needed because I used git svn clone
  •  
    Good at introducing concepts; not really great examples
Daniel Jomphe

Linus Torvalds: I Have Never Really Talked To Microsoft! - 0 views

  • I think it is much improved over the early drafts, and I don't think it's a horrible licence. I just don't think it's the same kind of 'great' licence that the GPLv2 is.So in the absence of the GPLv2, I could see myself using the GPLv3. But since I have a better choice, why should I?That said, I try to always be pragmatic, and the fact that I think the GPLv3 is not as good a licence as the GPLv2 is not a 'black and white' question. It's a balancing act. And if there are other advantages to the GPLv3, maybe those other advantages would be big enough to tilt the balance in favour of the GPLv3.Quite frankly, I don't really see any, but if Solaris really is to be released under the GPLv3, maybe the advantage of avoiding unnecessary non-compatible licence issues could be enough of an advantage that it might be worth trying to re-license the Linux kernel under the GPLv3 too.Don't get me wrong -- I think it's unlikely. But I do want to make it clear that I'm not a licence bigot, per se. I think the GPLv2 is clearly the better licence, but licences aren't everything.After all, I use a lot of programs that are under other licences. I might not put a project I start myself under the BSD (or the X11-MIT) licence, but I think it's a great licence, and for other projects it may well be the right one.
  • I like making strong statements, because I find the discussion interesting. In other words, I actually tend to 'like' arguing. Not mindlessly, but I certainly tend to prefer the discussion a bit more heated, and not just entirely platonic.And making strong arguments occasionally ends up resulting in a very valid rebuttal, and then I'll happily say: "Oh, ok, you're right."But no, that didn't happen on SVN/CVS. I suspect a lot of people really don't much like CVS, so I didn't really even expect anybody to argue that CVS was really anything but a legacy system. And while I've gotten a few people who argued that I shouldn't have been quite so impolite against SVN (and hey, that's fair -- I'm really not a very polite person!), I don't think anybody actually argued that SVN was 'good'.SVN is, I think, a classic case of 'good enough'. It's what people are used to, and it's 'good enough' to be used fairly widely, but it's good enough in exactly the sense DOS and Windows were 'good enough'. Not great technology, just very widely available, and it works well enough for people and looks familiar enough that people use it. But very few people are 'proud' of it, or excited about it.Git, on the other hand, has some of the 'UNIX philosophy' behind it. Not that it is about UNIX, per se, but like original UNIX, it had a fundamental idea behind it. For UNIX, the underlying philosophy was/is that, "Everything is a file." For git, it's, Everything is just an object in the content-addressable database."
  • I think there's both a licence issue, and a community and personality issue. The BSD licences always encouraged forking, but also meant that if somebody gets really successful and makes a commercial fork, you cannot necessarily join back. And so even if that doesn't actually happen (and it did, in the BSD cases -- with BSDi), people can't really 'trust' each other as much.In contrast, the GPLv2 also encourages forking, but it not only encourages the branching off part, it also encourages (and 'requires') the ability to merge back again. So now you have a whole new level of trust: you 'know' that everybody involved will be bound by the licence, and won't try to take advantage of you.So I see the GPLv2 as the licence that allows people the maximum possible freedom within the requirement that you can always join back together again from either side. Nobody can stop you from taking the improvements to the source code.
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  • So is the BSD licence even more 'free'? Yes. Unquestionably. But I just wouldn't want to use the BSD licence for any project I care about, because I not only want the freedom, I also want the trust so that I can always use the code that others write for my projects.So to me, the GPLv2 ends up being a wonderful balance of 'as free as you can make it', considering that I do want everybody to be able to trust so that they can always get the source code and use it.Which is why I think the GPLv3 ends up being a much less interesting licence. It's no longer about that trust about "getting the source code back"; it has degenerated into a "I wrote the code, so I should be able to control how you use it."In other words, I just think the GPLv3 is too petty and selfish. I think the GPLv2 has a great balance between 'freedom' and 'trust'. It's not as free as the BSD licences are, but it gives you peace of mind in return, and matches what I consider 'tit-for-tat': I give source code, you give me source code in return.The GPLv3 tries to control the 'use' of that source code. Now it's, "I give you my source code, so if you use it, you'd better make your devices hackable by me." See? Petty and small-minded, in my opinion.
  • I don't really believe in the 'browser OS', because I think that people will always want to do some things locally. It might be about security, or simply about privacy reasons. And while connectivity is widely available, it certainly isn't 'everywhere'. So I think the whole 'Web OS' certainly is part of the truth, but another part that people seem to dismiss is that operating systems have been around for decades, and it's really a fairly stable and well-known area of endeavour. People really shouldn't expect the OS to magically change: it's not like people were 'stupid' back in the 60s either, or even that hardware was 'that' fundamentally different back then!So don't expect a revolution. I think OSs will largely continue to do what they do, and while we'll certainly evolve, I don't think they'll change radically. What may change radically are the interfaces and the things you do on top of the OS (and certainly the hardware beneath the OS will continue to evolve too), and that's what people obviously care about.The OS? It's just that hidden thing that makes it all possible. You really shouldn't care about it, unless you find it very interesting to know what is really going on in the machine.
Daniel Jomphe

'Re: clarification on git, central repositories and commit access lists' - MARC - 0 views

  • With that I mean that in KWord I tend to work on a feature by first writing a unit test and committing that. After that I start to implement the feature until it actually passes the unit test and after that I add UIs etc etc etc. In other words; it takes me a week with 30 commits before I finish this new feature. And finish naturally doesn't mean bug-free. During this time I will surely find bugs in other pieces of code, or simple little features to add there. I commit those separately. All the above goes into one git tree and depending on how much I work with others on the features I publish that git tree. But the small fixes will be committed to the 'release' tree (aka svn) as soon as possible. At the end of the week when my feature is 'done' I will also push that upto the release tree. So, what IMOHO you, as a svn user, will end up with is the trunk that doesn't have half finished features that mess everything up. You will still see the current development (mostly) but not the dirty work-in-progress-excuse-the-mess versions. As an example; in Krita we have this excellent GSoC project for color mixing, the author programs in trunk and thus commits everything there. We have had a couple of times when his commits made it hard for others to try out his work. I.e. it was quite broken. I'm all for experimentation so I'm not complaining. But at the same time I do see it as a great opportunity for Git where I can imagine him committing his work-in-progress that is known to create regressions and publish that for other interrested people to see. And only after a week of hacking commit his updated version to the release tree so everyone can enjoy it. leaving the release tree free from major regressions.
  • And I believe that Git actually helps by allowing others to see a more representative version of the software instead of one that is constantly in flux.
  • All the workflows you are used to are still there, there just are more workflow possibilities and thus more ways to get productive. So, I really don't think it is in any way an extra barrier. It actually tears down several barriers.
Daniel Jomphe

Some thoughts on Git vs complexity | Javalobby - 0 views

  • Git is "simple" but hard. Subversion is "easy", but eventually complex.Git is *a lot* of features in one tool (think of the 100+ git plumbing commands). Each feature is simple, but learning to use them together is good bit of work. As soon as you've understood the model and you get that Eureka-moment, the tool never fails you, and you find it more and more fun to use the more you learn.
  • Git, on the other hand, is simple: It all boils down to being three kinds of objects in a graph (commits, blobs, trees), and the rest of it are algorithms that work this data-structure.
Olivier Valuet

ONJava.com -- Sussman on DVCS, Van Zyl using GIT+SVN - 0 views

  •  
    Sussman cautions that the world isn't ready for wide distributed version control adoption while a few high profile open source projects move towards adopting it. Maven is trying out GIT for external collaboration, and Sun is deploying Mercurial. What do you think?
Daniel Jomphe

SVN 1.5 - 0 views

  • that's not the whole picture. First and foremost you forgot the disconnected part. You can't commit to Subversion unless you can reach the repository, which is often in a server over the Internet. Also, each developer isn't restricted to one branch. He very often has a lot of them. Right now I have 28 separate branches of Qt in my workstation: they range from previous stable releases of Qt (to test regressions and fixes with) to branches I created to start working on fixing tasks to research projects.
  • And that's just my private branches. When I am collaborating with other people in projects, I have more branches. For one project right now in Qt, we are tracking 4 or 5 different branches, each with a different "theme": optimisations, new features, animations, etc. And there's an extra branch which is the merger of all those "theme branches", so that we can get a feel of what it will be when it's done.
  • Finally, you're also forgetting the ability to undo, redo, and modify your work. Once you commit to Subversion, it's there for life. Removing something from the repository means dumping and reloading it. With a Git, you can undo your commits, change them, squash them together without problems. (You can do that after you've published them, technically, but you shouldn't)
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  • people are asked to only commit stuff to trunk when they are done with it. Which for refactors and bigger things means it may be a week or more before you can commit it. And due to that requirement, thiago's post becomes very relevant. Those tools are essential to a scalable workflow.
Daniel Jomphe

'Re: clarification on git, central repositories and commit access lists' - MARC - 0 views

  • The biggest difference is that with git (or any other SCM that can _actually_ merge) multiple people can have their branches and merge with each other and after merging "annotate" and the like still work. That is not the case with svn and svnmerge.
Daniel Jomphe

'Re: clarification on git, central repositories and commit access lists' - MARC - 0 views

  • Well, it is working in the sense that we can use git without disrupting things for those who wish to continue working with svn. No, it isn't optimal for those who wish to completely convert to using git, but it is better than no git at all I guess.
Daniel Jomphe

'Re: clarification on git, central repositories and commit access lists' - MARC - 0 views

  • Another option is to look at git-svnserver which would allow a git repository backbone, but could talk svn over the wire which these tools could use...
Daniel Jomphe

'Re: clarification on git, central repositories and commit access lists' - MARC - 0 views

  • Btw, to see this in another light: as an example of a git tree that merges those same branches, but *before* they are ready, just look at the -mm tree. Now, Andrew actually ends up exposing the end result not as a git tree, but as patches, but what he actually *does* is to: - get my git tree - merge in about 30-40 other git trees from other developers (not all of which necessarily have actual development on them at any particular time) - then merge in his own patch list - expose it all as the -mm patch series So this is an example of how you actually have a totally separate, and still fairly central (the -mm tree is certainly now unknown outside of the core developer circles) tree, and where git is a big part in making a central "experimental" tree that is separate from my own central "development" tree. Also, it's an example of why centralization is bad: different people and entities have different intents. You could *not* reasonably do something like this with a centralized SCM like SVN.
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