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Jesper Lund Stocholm

Publicly Available Standards - 0 views

  • The following standards are made freely available for standardization purposes. They are protected by copyright and therefore and unless otherwise specified, no part of these publications may be reproduced or utilized in any form or by any means, electronic or mechanical, including photocopying, microfilm, scanning, reproduction in whole or in part to another Internet site, without permission in writing from ISO. Requests should be addressed to the ISO Central Secretariat.
  • ISO/IEC 29500-1:2008

    Electronic inserts



    1st

    Information technology -- Document description and processing languages -- Office Open XML File Formats -- Part 1: Fundamentals and Markup Language Reference

    JTC1/SC34



    ISO/IEC 29500-2:2008

    Electronic inserts


    1st

    Information technology -- Document description and processing languages -- Office Open XML File Formats -- Part 2: Open Packaging Conventions

    JTC1/SC34



    ISO/IEC 29500-3:2008


    1st

    Information technology -- Document description and processing languages -- Office Open XML File Formats -- Part 3: Markup Compatibility and Extensibility

    JTC1/SC34



    ISO/IEC 29500-4:2008

    Electronic inserts


    1st

    Information technology -- Document description and processing languages -- Office Open XML File Formats -- Part 4: Transitional Migration Features

    JTC1/SC34
    • Jesper Lund Stocholm
       
      Remenber also to download the electronic inserts containing e.g. reference schemas in electronic form.
  • ISO/IEC 26300:2006

    XHTML version

    1st
    Information technology -- Open Document Format for Office Applications (OpenDocument) v1.0

    XHTML version
  • Paul Merrell
     
    Most ISO and IEC standards are only available for purchase. However, a few are publicly available at no charge. ISO/IEC:26300-2006 is one of the latter and can be downloaded from this page in XHTML format. Note that the standards listed on the page are arranged numerically and the OpenDocument standard is very near the bottom of the page. This version of ODF is the only version that has the legal status of an international standard, making it eligible as a government procurement specification throughout all Member nations of the Agreement on Government Procurement.
Gary Edwards

Document Interoperability Initiative Demonstrates Momentum and Results: Industry collaborat... - 0 views

  • Gary Edwards
     
    Through the Document Interoperability Initiative (DII) global forums, technology leaders have been working together to promote interoperability between different document format implementations to provide greater value and choice to customers, and the events - including one held in Belgium this week - are yielding practical results.
    Interoperability solutions announced today translate Open XML documents to a Web page (HTML) allowing readability on Web-friendly browsers such as Firefox, improve translations between different formats through optimized templates, and enable features that provide greater choice for customers and opportunities for independent software developers as they create and use business applications built on Java that manipulate business documents. At the DII events, discussions were also held about developing document test libraries and schema validators, and vendors had the opportunity to test their implementations of document formats in a lab environment to identify potential issues to be addressed.
Gary Edwards

Microsoft OOXML viewers, translators, SDK to help interop with Firefox and OpenOffice? - 0 views

  • Gary Edwards
     
    On Dec 3, Microsoft officially announced the availability of its Open XML Document Viewer, Open XML/ODF Translators Version 2.5 and the Apache POI Java SDKfor OpenXML.
Jesper Lund Stocholm

OOXML is defective by design: Microsoft latest bullshit : native support of ODF in Office 2... - 0 views

  • I wanted to post a quick reaction to the latest Microsoft bullshit announcement, in which they reportedly plan to "add native support for ODF 1.1". The way they put is very succinct, intentionally probably, and it opens the door for wild guesses.

    First of all, Microsoft is a huge Office licensing monopoly. It's so big it even surpasses Windows in sales. Any decline in Office licensing would be dramatic for Microsoft's future. With that alone, you know that any announcement from Microsoft that they are willing to interoperate with other people's software, namely applications, should be taken with a grain of salt.

    Here is how, with the release of Office 2007, Microsoft intends to keep their monopoly in Office licensing :
  • Likewise, since Office 2007 is not a native XML application (the internal representation is a bunch of binary structure, not XML DOM)
    • Jesper Lund Stocholm
       
      Do any of you guys know if applications like OOo has a different internal object model? Is an ODF-document loaded into something equivilant to an XML DOM?
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Stephane is right on target. This is a must read for anyone trying to understand ISO approval of OOXML, and the sudden change of mind at Microsoft to support ODF!
Gary Edwards

OOXML is defective by design: Follow up on Microsoft latest bullshit announcement - 0 views

  • Microsoft has won. They wanted the ISO timestamp. They got it. They needed it since governments (and the EU) want such thing for documents now.
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Stephane Rodriquez sums it up: Microsoft has won ...

    "Future of OOXML? There are two answers. Frankly, who freaking cares the paper? This paper will ALWAYS be at odds with the actual Office implementation. We have a good example for the time being, but it has always been the case. What about the actual file format then? It will be the subject of reverse engineering from implementers whose only recourse is to catch up all the undocumented stuff. Make no mistake though, now it's about applications, not documents anymore."

    "Conclusion : if you are still in the OOXML conspiracy game, about time to move on guys. "
Gary Edwards

IDABC - EU: Microsoft's ODF-support draws mixed reactions - 0 views

  • Greve told the BBC that genuine adoption of ODF would give consumers more choice. "People will no longer need to use Microsoft Office in order to interoperate. People could switch to GNU/Linux and choose OpenOffice or other applications that support ODF, like Lotus Symphony or Google Docs."
  • Gary Edwards
     
    This is nonsense. Whether an organizations standardizes on ODF or OOXML, the "interoperability" they seek will still be based on every desktop running the same application. Neither format enables the interchange of documents between different applications - even if those applications properly implement the format standard. Anyone can prove this for themselves. Simply shuttle a few OpenOffice ODF documents between Symphony, Novell Office and Google Docs. Then weep. At least with MSOffice-OOXMLyou can exchange documents between different versions of MSOffice. Even though OpenOffice, Symphony and Novell Office are based on the same code base, interop might as well be zero.

    Besides; what end users really want from a modern desktop office suite is collaborative editing of web ready documents. This discussion is so last century - 1995!
Jesper Lund Stocholm

ISO - News - ISO and IEC approve OpenDocument OASIS standard for data interoperability of o... - 0 views

  • The OpenDocument Format OASIS standard that enables users of varying office suites to exchange documents freely with one another has just been approved for release as an ISO and IEC International Standard.
    • Jesper Lund Stocholm
       
      ODF approval in ISO
Jesper Lund Stocholm

Open Malaysia: ISO 26300 Published - 0 views

  • The OpenDocument Format (ISO 26300) has been officially published by ISO . More information is available here. This should put to rest any objections that ISO 26300 is not available in its official form for the reference of technologists.
    • Jesper Lund Stocholm
       
      The ISO-page lists the date of publication as November 30th 2006.
Gary Edwards

Office 2007 won't support ISO's OOXML - SD Times On The Web - 0 views

  • In a surprise move, the company also announced that it intends to participate in the OASIS ODF working group and the corresponding ISO/IEC Joint Technical Committee 1 Subcommittee 34 working groups for ODF, as well as the ISO Technical Committee 171 working group for PDF, said Doug Mahugh, senior product manager for Microsoft Office.

    He added that Microsoft would also introduce an API to allow developers to plug their own converters for formats, such as ODF, into Office to make it the default conversion path. ODF 1.1 was chosen over the ISO-standard ODF 1.0 as a practical decision based upon interoperability with existing implementations, Mahugh explained.
    • Paul Merrell
       
      The announcement of the new API for others to use for plug-ins is not new news. It was originally made when Microsoft claimed to have gotten religion on interoperability a few months ago. The wookie is that the only conceivable reason for a new API for use by others is that Microsoft does not want to disclose the specs for its existing API. That in turn suggests that the API for use by others will have functionality different from the API used by Microsoft itself, almost certainly far less.
  • “Customers that are expecting true document fidelity from XML-based, ISO-standard document formats will continue to be disappointed,” said Michael Silver, a Gartner Research vice president. Silver observed that the most compatible formats to use today are Microsoft’s legacy binaries, and he believes that Microsoft will be unlikely to convince customers to move to OOXML in the foreseeable future.
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Microsoft to support PDF, ODF 1.1 and ISO OOXML in MSOffice 14. The company will also join the OASIS ODF TC and working group for ISO PDF.
Gary Edwards

ConsortiumInfo.org - Standards to the People! (Updated Twice) - 0 views

  • I call on Ecma to withdraw OOXML from ISO and keep control of it themselves. We need it for legacy documents.
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Strange demands from Andy Updegrove: "I call on Ecma to withdraw OOXML from ISO and keep control of it themselves. We need it for legacy documents...."

    Why would anyone want Ecma to take back control of MSOffice-OOXML from ISO? The best circumstance would be for OASIS to turn OpenOffice-ODF over to the same ISO JTC-S1, where they can finally begin the difficult (if not impossible) harmonization process. Let me add on other thing; the place for ISO to begin harmonization is "presentation". We desperately need a standardized presentation model useful to MSOffice-OOXML, OpenOffice-ODF, XHTML and HTML. I suggest they start with CSS 3, and work back into ODF - OOXML. But that's just me :)
Gary Edwards

Griffin Brown Weblog - ODF validation for the cognoscenti - 0 views

  • Gary Edwards
     
    Rob Weir gets royally spanked. And so does the notion that ODF is somehow "interoperable". Big Time.
Gary Edwards

OOXML: The next step - Interop at the International Standards legal level | Marbux - Weir -... - 0 views

  • Both ODF and OOXML are only one WTO Dispute Resolution Process complaint
    away from losing their international standard, national technical
    regulation, and government procurement specification status. They do not
    meet the minimum requirements of international law. Both are unnecessary
    obstacles to international trade; neither specify a uniform and
    substitutable product. That does not sound like a sound business plan to me.

    So I return to my question posed in an earlier post: Will ODF v. 1.2 under
    your leadership attempt to "clearly and unambiguously specify that
    conformance requirements essential to achieve the interoperability" and will
    the standards-based interoperability between *different* IT systems be
    "demonstrable," as required by JTC 1 Directives?

    That is not a complicated question and it requires no deep dive into
    international law to answer. International law requires what the quoted JTC
    1 Directives require in this regard, but for purposes of the point under
    discussion we need go no further than the Directives' plain language.


    One either adheres to the rules or one forfeits the moral high ground to
    complain when others ignore the rules. Where does Rob Weir stand on
    complying with the rules?
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Marbux at his best! Here he responds to Rob Weir's ODF v 1.2 arguments with a legal dissertation on International Standards, ISO, the WTO, and the key issue of interoperability and what it must mean. Excellent!
Gary Edwards

OOXML and ODF: The next step | [odf-discuss] Marbux Responds! - 0 views

  • The issue we were discussing -- and what I believe the ODEF conference was
    very much concerned with -- was whether ODF plus vendor-specific extensions
    will be classified as conformant ODF. The market requirement is for
    "Exchange Formats" and document-level interoperability.

    I could repose my question as whether ODF v. 1.2 will "clearly and
    unambiguously specify interoperability requirements essential to achieve the
    interoperability," as required by JTC 1 Directives. As you noted in an
    earlier post in this thread, you can't do interoperability if you use vendor
    extensions.


    > I see a standard as providing a shared vocabulary for buyers and sellers
    > to express their requirements.


    You are in error. This is a matter controlled by law rather than by personal
    opinion. Standards are all about the substitutability of goods, weights, and
    measures. A standard specifies all characteristics of a product, weight, or
    measure in mandatory terms so there is uniformity. Standards are the
    antithesis of product differentiation. Their very purpose is to eliminate
    product differentiation.
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Excellent legal argument by the legendary marbux concerning OOXML and ODF itneroperability. Covers ISO Interop Requirements and the demands of International Trade Agreements. Key to this thread is ODF v 1.2 and what must be done to bring ODF into legal compliance with International demands.
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Outstanding analysis and research by the legendary marbux
Gary Edwards

OOXML OPS and the GPL: A disappointing surprise from the SFLC | Gray Matter - 0 views

  • I view the spec as confusing, obtuse, error-ridden, x86-centric, incomplete, and redundant.  Microsoft sat on the board of ODF for _years_ without offering any help on the minor items ODF didn't provide that they wanted.  Now that governments start pressing for permanent standards on document storage, MS throws out this half-baked item and expects a reward for good behavior.  Maybe somebody on the board of directors at our company likes it, but the technical folks having to add more work are less than happy about this beast.


    If they had to go with XML, couldn't they at least have allowed standard XML with attributes and the like instead of x86 specific, binary incompatible, past-version deprecating, standard-avoiding, crash on normal XML.. ... mess... that they have offered for consumption?  Oh.. but wait, I'm sure the BRM fixed that in the week given.  I'm sure the pretty version will show up any day now.

  • Gary Edwards
     
    Scott B comment on the OOXML OPS and GPL controversy. Great comments from Bruce Perens also.
Gary Edwards

OOXML and ISO: The Process Challenge - A Predictable Path | Matusow's Blog - 0 views

  • Where can we expect challenges?
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Scott B responds to Matusow blathering with a list of ISO changes that should be made given the OOXML fiasco, but won't.
Gary Edwards

OOXML: MSOffice Open XML - Where The Rubber Meets The Road | Matusow's Blog - 0 views

  • There can be no doubt that OOXML, as a standard, has severe flaws.   It is incomplete, platform specific, application specific, full of contradictions, fails to adhere to existing standards, untestable, and presents a moving target for any IT worker.  There is not an organization in existence, including Microsoft, that promises to actually implement the full standard.  Much of this is due to the fact the final version doesn't actually exist on paper yet, but a large fraction is also do to the patchwork nature of the product.


    The reason governments and companies wanted a 'office apps' standard in the first place was to release an avalanche of data from aging applications.  OOXML shows every appearance of being created to prevent this escape, not enable it.   The immaturity of the standard means that it remains a gamble to see if older documents will remain readable or not.  The lack of testing means there is no way to determine what docs actually adhere to it or not.  The ignoring of existing standards guarantees compatibility problems.  All of these factors are handy for the owner of the biggest share of existing documents, as it forces users to continue to use only _their_ application or risk danger from every other quarter.

  • Gary Edwards
     
    Perhaps the single best comment i've ever read concerning OOXML and the value of standards. Very concise and too the point. Thanks you Scott B!
  • Gary Edwards
     

    ISO NB's approved MS-OOXML not because it meets ISO Interoperability Requirements. It doesn't. OOXML doesn't even come close. They approved OOXML because it's the best deal they can get given the MSOffice predicament their governments are caught in.



    Governments got the binary blueprints they have been insisting on, but didn't get the mapping of those binaries to OOXML.



    Governemnts also took control of OOXML, with Patrick Durusau and the JTC-1 now in copmplete control of the specifications future. Sadly though, Durusau and company will not be able to make the interop changes they know are required by ISO and related World Trade Agreements. The OOXML charter prevents any changes that would degrade in any way compatibility with MSOffice! This charter lock was on full display in the Microsoft - Ecma response to Geneva BRM comment resolutions, with Microsoft refusing to address any comments that would alter compliance with MSOffice.



    Durusau has always believed that a one to one mapping between OOXML and ODF is possible. Just prior to the Geneva BRM though, the EU DIN Workgroup released their preliminary report on harmonization, which they found to be a next to impossible task given the applicaiton specific nature of both ODF and OOXML.



    The DIN Report no doubt left the mapping-harmonization crowd (lead by Durusau) with few choices other than to take control of OOXML and figure out the binary to OOXML mappings for themselves, wih the hope that somewhere down the road OpenOffice will provide OOXML documents. Meaning, governments are not looking at open standards for XML documents as much as they are looking to crack the economic hammer lock Microsoft has on the desktop.

Gary Edwards

Microsoft's Great Besmirching | Linux Journal - 0 views

  • Of course, all companies try to bend the rules in the their favour, and it would be unfair to pick on Microsoft for doing the same. But what has happened over the last year and a half goes so far beyond the accepted rough and tumble of the standards game that cumulatively it can only be considered as an all-out attack on the machinery of standards-making. Consider the evidence.
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Glyn Moody provides a summary of the destruction of ISO
Gary Edwards

Microsoft OOXML standardization bid: The clock is ticking | All about Microsoft | ZDNet.com... - 0 views

  • The battle over OOXML standarization is all about money and marketshare. Microsoft wants OOXML to qualify as an “open standard” so that the company can continue to sell Office into governments that see ISO as the gold standard bearer. Many of the companies  that have fought publicly against OOXML gaining ISO standardization approval are hoping that failure of OOXML to get the ISO nod will give them a chance to gain more marketshare in a world where Office still runs on more than 90 percent of Windows desktops.
Gary Edwards

The Stockholm Syndrom at ISO | ODF Editor Says ODF Loses If OOXML Does | Slashdot - 0 views

  • ISO is bound to the business of "interoperability", and has very strict guidelines for interoperability requirements, that are themselves tied to international trade agreements and legal conventions. In this context, it is beyond surprising that ISO allows the "OASIS PAS" and "Ecma Fast Track" channels to remain open, with specification work remaining under the controlling influence of the vendors.

    IMHO, the change in Patrick's position is entirely due to the realization that it is impossible to map between OOXML and ODF. I don't know this for sure, but when i read the German Standards Group (DIN) report on harmonization, authorized by the EU-IDABC and provided to ISO, i couldn't help but wonder how Patrick would react. The report definitively ends his OOXML ODF mapping dream.
  • Gary Edwards
     
    Response to Yoon Kit's comments that Patrick Durusau is caught between a rock and hard place. His ISO JTC-1 group is now overwhelmed with MS OOXML supporters!
Gary Edwards

The Charter Dilemma | ODF Editor Says ODF Loses If OOXML Does | Slashdot - 0 views

  • OOXML on the other hand presents ISO with a very different situation. Because of the way the OOXML - Ecma charter is worded, i don't see how ISO JTC-1 could ever fix the OOXML interoperability problems. ISO approval of OOXML would include acceptance of a charter that defines and limits OOXML interoperability to whatever MSOffice determines it to be. If Patrick and the JTC-1 tried to bring OOXML into compliance with existing ISO Interoperability Requirements, they would have to somehow amend a charter duly approved.

    Given that the JTC-1 has yet to address a two year old ISO directive regarding ODF interop compliance, what are the odds they will dare to amend an approved charter? Not good i think.

    ISO approval of OOXML is a tragedy for all of us. For sure it's the end of ODF. It's perhaps the end of ISO as a respected standards organization. The issue of open standards itself will become a joke, with the reality of standards by corporation having us all wringing our hands in despair.
  • Gary Edwards
     
    This commentary follows the Stockholm Syndrom post, which is itself in the thread based on Yoon Kit's Open Malaysia comments concerning the dilemma Patrick Durusau is in; the JTC-1 is now filled with Microsoft OOXML supporters!
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